So I'm a Spider, So What? - Kumo Desu ga, Nani ka?

[Kraco]

So Kumoko would take over the demon lord or assume her shape because Ariel's an already established ruler of the monsters? Easier to use her existing position/fame than to replace her as a totally new monster. I can't say I'd feel terrible sorry for her. But if that's the case, what is the pale lady? A random vestige that happened to develop much better than the rest? Or maybe something Kumoko was using during the process of taking over the demon lord. If the 15 years later demon lord indeed is Kumoko, then it doesn't really need to be pondered how the demon lord would have something related to Kumoko serving her. It would just be Kumoko serving Kumoko.

[DarthEnderX]

If the White Lady and Ariel are both Kumoko, I'm assuming she just has one of her minds piloting whichever body her original mind isn't in.

[MFauli]

And re: MFauli's "Is this world real or digital" thing..

At the beginning of episode 11, Kumoko gained world wisdom and the following was flashed on screen:

Humans discover MA Energy
Earth Lifespan Decreases
Dragons attack Humanity due to loss.
Goddess Sariel
Countdown to oblivion
(Sariel) Sacrificed to revive the world
Administrator Guiliedistodiez
System implemented.
Sariel's wish and The Goddess's Life Support.

My interpretation of that limited information is that:
-Humans are destroying the earth after using this MA energy thing. MA... as in F=MA?
-Dragons get pissed and attack.
-This goddess called Sariel decides to try to save the world by sacrificing herself, but then somehow our Dragon Administrator friend Guiliedistodiez intervenes (or knows someone who intervenes)..
-and the current "game world / system" is put in place in order to somehow both save the Goddess and stop the end of the world from happening or something.

It's giving me Matrix gibes at this point.

And it'd be some twist if the "noble goddess" had a sick sense of humour/entertainment whist calling herself "D".

But would a dragon goddess use a ... video game like system? Eh. Hella weird.

Honestly, I'd prefer a more simple "someone built a VRMMORPG, trapped these students and their teacher inside, and now they have to find a way to return to the real world against all odds". Not as out there, but at least somewhat sensical ;>

[Ryllharu]

But would a dragon goddess use a ... video game like system? Eh. Hella weird.

Honestly, I'd prefer a more simple "someone built a VRMMORPG, trapped these students and their teacher inside, and now they have to find a way to return to the real world against all odds". Not as out there, but at least somewhat sensical ;>

Yeah, but that's been done, and over done for decades and decades. LitRPG as a proper genre in and of itself is more recent, and the term is self is coined from Russian writers circles. They have heavy emphasis on stat based systems, but without the "trapped in a video game" plot trope.

Kumo Desu, and a few other popular ones out there, are one of these. They provide a framework for readers to understand power gains of the characters, and a shortcut for authors to convey more complicated details. Think of it like an extremely well defined Hard Magic System compared to a Soft Magic System. It both limits the author but also lets them discuss typically difficult to write sensations of power growth.

[DarthEnderX]

They have heavy emphasis on stat based systems, but without the "trapped in a video game" plot trope.

Kumo Desu, and a few other popular ones out there, are one of these.

Girls In A Dungeon, KonoSuba and Sield Hero all appear to be that as well.

[Ryllharu]

I wouldn't count Shield Hero and Konosuba honestly. Haven't seen the third one so I can't say.

Konosuba only uses it for gags, and shield hero has them but they never really come into play. Maybe "omg these new evil people have higher stats than us, we better train!"...training arc... "Now we can match them!"

Kumo Desu has the stats play out the combat narratives themselves, or rather the stats are plotted out and matched so they do in precise detail.

[Kraco]

I find it funny that in RL when you go for a run, you naturally sense how tired you are and can estimate how long you still can keep running. An isekai MC needs to bring up the UI window, check the stamina/SP/whatever and see how much they have spent and how much is left.

[DarthEnderX]

I wouldn't count Shield Hero and Konosuba honestly. Haven't seen the third one so I can't say.

Konosuba only uses it for gags, and shield hero has them but they never really come into play. Maybe "omg these new evil people have higher stats than us, we better train!"...training arc... "Now we can match them!"

But they still have them. They have classes and levels and stats and skills. Despite not living inside a video game. Even if they aren't used as important plot points(and Shield Hero absolutely DOES btw), it doesn't make it any less "that kind of setting".

An isekai MC needs to bring up the UI window, check the stamina/SP/whatever and see how much they have spent and how much is left.

And I'd honestly kill to have that, because people's ability to judge that for themselves is actually terrible.

[Buffalobiian]

I'd love for my Stamina to be a bar than to actually feel it plummet.

Feeling damage is useful as a reflex to an extent.

Weight can also just be a number as well thanks.

[MFauli]

A stamina bar irl would be terrible: It'd be like a coach telling you 'one more time, you got this! Come on!', when you're already feeling like shit. But hey, the stamina bar isn't empty, so cleay I should keep going, huh ...

;i

[David75]

Well, to level up you need to push your limits reasonably... as weird as it sounds.

[Buffalobiian]

A stamina bar irl would be terrible: It'd be like a coach telling you 'one more time, you got this! Come on!', when you're already feeling like shit. But hey, the stamina bar isn't empty, so cleay I should keep going, huh ...

;i

The point of a stamina bar is that you don't feel its effects until it's empty and you go into the out-of-stamina animation.

That was the joke about the weight - that it has no effect (and no visual effect) until a certain threshold is met. -_-

[MFauli]

The point of a stamina bar is that you don't feel its effects until it's empty and you go into the out-of-stamina animation.

That was the joke about the weight - that it has no effect (and no visual effect) until a certain threshold is met. -_-

I get it, but realistically if that were the case, your avatar wouldn't be able to feel anything, right? You might not realize, but stamina is part of everything you do and feel. Even just a handshake requires stamina to feel "right", without stamina it becomes ... weird, like when you're playing a sword fighting-game on the Wii, but there's no hit-feedback because nothing keeps your controller irl from going right through the obstacle (i.e. the enemy sword). Stamina is what adds weight to our actions, so I assumed that there would still be some wear involved, just not to total depletion like would happen to most of us within seconds.

[DarthEnderX]

Stamina is what adds weight to our actions, so I assumed that there would still be some wear involved, just not to total depletion like would happen to most of us within seconds.

No. The point of having bars is for it to work like a video game. Not how it works in real life.

I can do whatever I want till my Sta hits 0, then I can't do shit.

[MFauli]

Episode 20:

So Kumoko became Ariel's master in the future, eh?

I'm so looking forward to the "war" in the past. One blink and entire hundreds of soldiers will drop dead, lol.

That diplomat that Oht sent really cant be seen as anything but the desire to go to war. But I didn't quite get how Kumoko killed him. Thought it was poisoned wine at first.

My number 1 question as of this point is: WHY is Kumoko going to war with all of mankind in the present time?! If she wants to save earth, shouldn't she avoid an all-out extinction war? lol

But we can probably also rule out Kumoko having acquired human form - unless she chose that telecommunication spider on Ariel's shoulder for nostalgia's sake.

[DarthEnderX]

I lol'd at her "Oh no, humans are such juicy delicious xp! I HATE how they're forcing me to kill them all!"

But I didn't quite get how Kumoko killed him. Thought it was poisoned wine at first.

One of her eye attacks is literally just a "drop dead glare". And her clairvoyance lets her use it from miles away.

WHY is Kumoko going to war with all of mankind in the present time?! If she wants to save earth, shouldn't she avoid an all-out extinction war?

If the world dies because of humans overusing some power, then killing off a ton of them is probably good for the planet.

But we can probably also rule out Kumoko having acquired human form - unless she chose that telecommunication spider on Ariel's shoulder for nostalgia's sake.

I don't see how that rules out her being an arachne.

If she was going to make minions, they'd be tiny spiders, not tiny spider-ladies. The Queen Taratect doesn't make other Queen Taratects after all.

[Ryllharu]

That was a nicely composed parallel narrative. Both Kumoko and Oka made their respective timelines worse with good intentions.

Kumoko is trying to save Sophia and her family from the elves or any other external forces. Why? 'She felt like it.' Her haphazard whim is why Gilly-Gilly came to visit and ask why, but Kumoko's answer is because you should just do what you feel like doing? He was surprised like it had never occurred to him before. I guess he is a very duty-bound Administrator, while Kumoko matches so much more with D. I guess that's why D likes her. Kumoko does things, and yeah, some of them backfire. Some of them still would have happened with or without her. She's only speeding things along.

Oka on the other hand, was fake in her past life, which I was surprised at. She was very calculated in her cutesy personality, and constantly full of self-doubt. Her desire to protect her students handed them all to Potimas, which, while it was her only option, also seems like it ended up being the absolute worst option. The elves are shady and evil, that's for sure, and Potimas used his daughter's good intentions to consolidate his own power.

My number 1 question as of this point is: WHY is Kumoko going to war with all of mankind in the present time?! If she wants to save earth, shouldn't she avoid an all-out extinction war? lol

Literally because Sophia is the first fellow student she's met. That's it, haha.

Kumoko knows she has to intervene, but I doubt she has any clue where to start. So she's doing what she can and because she feels like it. We don't really know either. Does she have to repair the system or destroy it? It didn't seem like Gilly-Gilly knew either. The world is dying and nobody knows the current cause of what is continuing the problem, only the previous one that broke it in the first place, and nobody knows how to reverse it.

Oka plead to locals for help, and it has brought her nothing but pain, rejection, and more doubt. In fact, the more she intervenes, the worse she makes the later timeline. She depowered Hugo, which made him resent the elves and Shun all the more, which lead to a lot of deaths, the enslavement of Shun's family and loved ones, and Katia's premature death (speaking of which, I'm not sure that Shun averted Katia's death yet either, they're only 15, and Oka's roster says she dies at 20 after being de-powered, like by the Church who deletes skills?).

[Kraco]

Oka was the biggest surprise for me in this episode. Like none of you might remember, I was talking a long time ago how I suspect Oka knows everything and thus she's also trying to save the world by going along with the elves' questionable plans and whatnot. However, now it was revealed she actually doesn't necessarily know much, she only has the roster. I very much suspect Potimas is only telling Oka as much as he deems useful, and not all of it is going to be true either, I bet. Oka only cares about her students, so as long as Potimas can make it look like it's for the sake of the students, he can use Oka as he wishes. I imagine he has used her a whole lot, which is pretty much what Sophia was suggesting as well.

I'm now all but convinced the pale lady is Kumoko. I was against it before, when I still didn't know Kumoko might actually be one up on the demon lord. If she has got the demon lord subdued, it doesn't matter what Kumoko is doing, nobody's going to threaten her. As we saw in this episode, once again, Kumoko isn't exactly the sharpest poison fang in the world. So, maybe Kumoko actually is much happier being a gray eminence than the topmost figurehead. On the other hand, if the demon lord is, in the 15 years after world, just another part of Kumoko (if Kumoko's parallel mind ate the demon lord's whole soul and replaced her), it might still please Kumoko that she's not, in her main persona, the one responsible for leading the whole demon world. Of course she could grow along the way, but how she acted in front of Gilly-Gilly wasn't very self-confident and charismatic.

Nevertheless, this is one series where I really don't want a major time skip.

[MFauli]

i kinda hate the "know their death" ability, though. Does that mean everything that happens is already determined, as in, D has a file that shows everything? Or does D kill people at that time, no matter what? Either way, it takes away from our heroes accomplishing anything on their own, now it's just "how can we rewrite history". I'm sure this ability will be ignored for the most part, but actually this is now an entirely different show. Forget about "saving the world from destruction", it's now "fighting the future death of my students". And where does it even end? Once Oka avoids one death date, will it just change to another a little later on? Basically she'll fight it her whole life.

Nah, not a fan of all that.

[Kraco]

i kinda hate the "know their death" ability, though. Does that mean everything that happens is already determined, as in, D has a file that shows everything? Or does D kill people at that time, no matter what? Either way, it takes away from our heroes accomplishing anything on their own, now it's just "how can we rewrite history". I'm sure this ability will be ignored for the most part, but actually this is now an entirely different show. Forget about "saving the world from destruction", it's now "fighting the future death of my students". And where does it even end? Once Oka avoids one death date, will it just change to another a little later on? Basically she'll fight it her whole life.

Nah, not a fan of all that.

If D is behind the roster, who knows if it even works. She's a giant troll. If the world is being destroyed, she could also just have that time limit as the death point for everyone.